Callum, 19, Southend

Occupation Pre-trade surveyor

Voting record He’d give the Conservatives a chance to unruin everything, or maybe give Reform a go

Amuse bouche Callum has raced motorcycles and come off more times than he can count

Emma, 31, London

Occupation Solicitor

Voting record Still votes in Canada, always Liberal. Here, usually Labour, sometimes Green, once voted Lib Dem because they made sense of the whole Brexit thing

Amuse bouche Emma is currently crocheting in a hammock, working on matching cardigans for a baby and mum

For starters

Callum I was surprised. She wasn’t the kind of person I expected to be as opinionated as she was. The whole Canadian aspect took me by surprise.

Emma He was in a lovely suit, with his hair slicked back, and he just looked like a young Conservative.

Callum I had the meatballs in a sauce with a potato puree and some Ibérico cured meat.

Emma I got a really nice chargrilled asparagus, and an aubergine.

The big beef

Callum The monarchy is not something that can just be abolished or got rid of because maybe a landscape’s changed politically or opinion has changed. It’s an institution that’s run deep for hundreds of years. Our armed forces swear allegiance to the monarch, and that makes them a lot harder to corrupt or turn astray, because they’re being led by a monarch who upholds the values of Britain.

Emma I thought he would be pro-royal for the tradition. People love to tout the tourist thing as if it’s a petting zoo. But in fact he was in the cadets for seven years and he was, like, “I wouldn’t want to swear allegiance to Keir Starmer, it has to be a monarch.” It was a really interesting point of view – you want to die, for a monarch? But nobody swears allegiance to Donald Trump; you do it for the nation. It’s arbitrarily determined by where you’re born. The German military would not have a crown to swear on.

Callum She said, “They swallow a lot of public money, certain members have been called into question, doing things that maybe aren’t so clearcut.” Don’t get me wrong, that was a perfectly valid point. Obviously they are born into it, they don’t work for it, and that’s been taken advantage of. I could see her point. But she didn’t change my mind. She said nobody should be above the law, and that’s true, but ours aren’t. Consequences of their actions hit them.

Emma Let’s say some freak accident happened and the whole royal family died, and only Andrew was left, would you swear to him? Then I said, “If you want to keep the monarchy, name five you’d swear to.” And the first three he named were women; that really impressed me. He did have a good sense of humour.

Sharing plate

Callum You shouldn’t be upset or offended or feel under any sort of pressure by the flag of a nation that you’ve, willingly or otherwise, taken refuge in. To arrive somewhere and expect people to take a national flag down because it doesn’t align with what you want is a little bit ridiculous. The meaning of a flag cannot be changed by who hangs it; it still represents the national identity.

Emma He said, “Some people feel ignored by them and the flag is a way to say, we’re here, don’t ignore us.” I said, “Who is being ignored by whom?” And he said, “Working-class people ignored by the government.” I was, like, “Is the flag not the insignia of the government?” And he said, “No, it’s the nation’s flag.” When I see a St George’s cross somewhere, it’s yucky – they’ve put that up for a reason, it’s not neutral, but I do not feel threatened.

For afters

Emma We got on to the European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR) and I said, “Who do you want to torture?” And he said, “What? I don’t want to torture anybody.” And I said, “Why do you want to get rid of it if you don’t want to torture anybody? It’s article 3.” And he said, “I know what article it is.”

Callum The ECHR has some serious overreach, and calls into question whether we’re being governed by an elected body, or an unelected body, the European Union.

Takeaway

Callum She was very nice, very lovely.

Emma He didn’t give weird, Andrew Tate vibes. He was very anti-misogyny. He contained multitudes.

Callum and Emma ate at El Pirata, London W1

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Additional reporting: Kitty Drake