Statements by Ruslan Kutayev — president of the Assembly of Peoples of the Caucasus and a member of the PACE platform representing Russia’s indigenous peoples — are generating widespread debate in the Russian opposition. In an interview with a Ukrainian YouTube channel, he said that when the time comes, Chechens will “return to Moscow” and control the Russian capital so that it “doesn’t get uppity with the surrounding peoples.” Journalist Alexander Plushev later invited Kutayev onto his program to clarify remarks that may have been misunderstood, but the conversation produced several more explosive statements: Kutayev justified “honor killings” and compared queer people to “outcasts” and “perverts,” saying they should not “put themselves on display.” Human rights advocates and journalists are now demanding that Kutayev be removed from his role at PACE and asking how he came to be there in the first place.

In late March, Ruslan Kutayev gave an interview to the Ukrainian YouTube channel “Rizni liudi,” in which he outlined his vision for a future redistribution of power in Russia and the role Chechens would play in it.

“We won’t just come back — first we’ll do some work in Moscow. We’ll install the power in Moscow that suits us,” Kutayev said, noting that up to four million Muslims live in the Russian capital.

“And when it’s time to act in Russia — we will act. And only with our agreement will the power that governs Russia be established. Only with us. […] We will control Moscow so that Moscow doesn’t get uppity with the surrounding peoples and surrounding states,” he added, contrasting Chechens with “little students who will walk around with flashlights.”

The interview drew attention a month later. On April 24, journalist Alexander Plushev invited Kutayev onto his program to clarify his statements about Moscow and the change of power. Kutayev said again that when change comes, the peoples of the Caucasus who hold Russian citizenship will have to be reckoned with, and that if necessary, they would “go to the barricades.”

In the same conversation, Kutayev addressed the situation of LGBTQ+ people who face persecution in Chechnya, making clear he had no interest in their problems. “I am a representative of the conservative part of Chechen society. In Chechen society, such behavior is perceived not merely as painful, but very, very seriously. […] In defending the rights of minorities, we must not encroach on the rights of the majority,” he said.

Chechen society has, in his telling, “a compromise solution” on the matter: if people “position themselves in some way,” they should “go about your business quietly — there’s no need to go around saying I’m a Chechen man, I’m a Chechen woman, and put us on display, knowing that it offends us.” Kutayev also said that “in defending ourselves from our internal outcasts, perverts, we are trying to preserve ourselves as the Chechen society we inherited.” “We like being this way. That’s who we are,” he added.

Kutayev described honor as the paramount issue for Chechens — “higher than life” — and said that “every family makes its own decision — the father, the mother, the uncle, the brother, the son.” When the host asked whether a family in Chechnya has the right to kill a relative who “shames” it, Kutayev replied with a question of his own: “Why does a member of that family have the right to shame that family?”

The family makes the decision — exclusively. Neither Kadyrov, nor Zakayev, nor Putin influences the decision. Whatever they do — kill, bring home, expel, arrange a wedding — the family decides.

The human rights group SK SOS, which assists residents of the North Caucasus who have suffered from domestic violence, responded by demanding that Kutayev be removed from his work at PACE, arguing that he was justifying “honor killings” of Chechen women and LGBTQ+ people. “His statements effectively legitimize extrajudicial violence, abuse, and impunity — this is incompatible with the basic principles of human rights,” SK SOS said.

On April 27, journalist Renat Davletgildeev addressed representatives of the platform of Russian democratic forces at PACE on Facebook with several questions about Kutayev’s interview on Plushev’s program. The conversation had “turned into a parade of blatant homophobia,” Davletgildeev argued, and such statements were unacceptable. He asked whether the PACE platform supports Kutayev’s statements, what its official position is on the violation of the rights of queer people and women in the Caucasus, and whether a “person who refuses to defend LGBTQ+ people and calls them ‘perverts’” can represent a human rights and democratic agenda at PACE.

Colleagues backed Davletgildeev. “Kutayev asks what right girls have to shame their traditional Chechen families. And I want to ask who gave this, ahem, politician the right to shame Russia at PACE,” wrote Elena Malakhovskaya, host of the YouTube channel “Khodorkovsky Live.” “I support the outrage and the questions. How did this devil end up among human rights defenders at all,” wrote journalist Ksenia Larina, sharing Davletgildeev’s post.

Olga Sadovskaya, a lawyer with the Committee Against Torture who had handled Kutayev’s case at the European Court of Human Rights — he had filed a complaint with the ECHR over his prosecution on fabricated charges — also weighed in, calling the episode a scandal “in one European democratic body that was formed in an undemocratic way.” “And in connection with what happened, here’s what I want to say: even the most primitive person who divides people into categories should not be subjected to violence. But that doesn’t stop him from being a primitive person,” she wrote on Facebook.

Businessman Mikhail Khodorkovsky, who also participates in the work of the Russian opposition platform at PACE, said Kutayev’s interview contained “many different aspects that would be worth discussing.” But the platform’s goal, in Khodorkovsky’s view, was “not unity of views, but to bring together a spectrum of them and try to establish a dialogue.” “Hence the diversity of participants and opinions. We are there to learn to coexist and resolve common issues despite categorical disagreement on a whole range of other problems. And so far — it’s working,” he wrote on social media.