Pennsylvania Governor Josh Shapiro (D) urged voters Thursday night to reject what he described as “the chaos, the cruelty, and the corruption of Donald Trump” as he described the midterm elections as a defining test of American democracy and “referendum” on the president.

Shapiro made the comments when speaking to MS NOW host Jen Psaki at the network’s live “We the People: America 250” event before a sold-out audience at Philadelphia’s Academy of Music. The event drew nearly 2,000 attendees to hear hosts Rachel Maddow, Psaki, Ali Velshi and constitutional scholar Sherrilyn Ifill speak throughout the evening.

During his sitdown, Shapiro reflected on Benjamin Franklin’s famous warning that the United States would remain “a republic, if you can keep it” — arguing that preserving American democracy has always depended on ordinary citizens.

“The reason I am hopeful, the reason why I am optimistic is because I think we will channel Franklin’s words again,” Shapiro said. “Where folks are going to rise up they’re going to speak out against the corruption of this administration. They’re going to show up in record numbers in these midterms, and we will have a national referendum on the chaos, the cruelty, and the corruption of Donald Trump.”

Throughout the conversation with Psaki, Shapiro repeatedly accused Trump of amassing excessive executive authority while criticizing both Congress and the Supreme Court for failing to provide meaningful checks.

“When our founders gathered at Independence Hall and first declared our independence, then wrote our Constitution a decade later, the biggest fear they had was that one individual would accumulate too much power that they would become a tyrant, that they would become what we had already just walked away from, and that is being governed by a king,” he said.

“Our founders, our framers built a system of checks and balances to deny the executive the kind of power that we have seen Trump accumulate,” he added.

Shapiro then turned on Congress, which he argued had become “profoundly and pathetically weak” telling attendees: “They have given up on their checks. They have given up on their constitutional obligation.”

He continued to slam the Supreme Court’s presidential immunity ruling as the “arguably most dangerous” act of recent times in removing critical “guardrails.”

“It’s one of the reasons why I think we have got to really think about a 28th Amendment to our Constitution to actually rein in the corruption that we’re seeing from this executive,” he added. “We need anti-corruption laws being passed by Congress. And we need to take back our democracy and think back to the fears that [James] Madison and [George] Washington and Franklin and others had, fearing the excesses of an executive.”

“We got work to do to roll that back, but I’m committed to doing that work,” the governor said.

Rounding on the immunity ruling he followed: “I think you have to start by overturning the Supreme Court decision that a president is absolutely immune. I think that is foundational to everything we do going forward.”

The Democratic governor also pointed to his own legal battles against Trump while serving as Pennsylvania attorney general.

“When he tried to throw out your votes back in 2020, he and his enablers sued me 43 times,” Shapiro said. “And, by the way, he went 0 and 43, and I went 43 and 0.”

Shapiro also pledged to continue defending voting rights in Pennsylvania, touting what he described as a fresh court victory protecting mail voting.

“As your governor, I will not be afraid to go back to court to protect your right to vote,” he said, adding that state officials were preparing with law enforcement and the National Guard to ensure voters could cast ballots without interference.

Psaki also briefly prodded Shapiro about persistent speculation that he could seek a future Democratic presidential nomination, noting he appears on “everybody’s 2028 presidential list.”

Shapiro dodged the question with humor, replying: “I’m actually – I’m afraid to blink,” before attempting to change the subject by introducing Maddow from offstage.

“Ladies and gentlemen, Rachel Maddow,” he joked, drawing laughter from the crowd.

“See what he did there?” Psaki teased.

“Get out here, Rachel,” the governor urged.

“You’re our guest. So you don’t –” she began, turning to the audience: “He has a lot of power, but not that power.”

“Not that power,” Shapiro smiled.

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